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Jim Barker
Jim Barker's picture
European Larch
Anyone had problems milling Larch? Never had a problem till today on one log, felt as though hit metal butblade still sharp so able to finish cut and log. Each board it would do it in a different place and reveals a ripple but half circular like a circular saw blade cut and occasionally a dip.
Bill
Bill's picture
I think you hit something and changed the set in a few teeth band-saw blades that feel sharp can be deceiving maybe just a few teeth damaged?
Jim Barker
Jim Barker's picture
Changed blade after first time it happened. log squared to a cant so no bark, no metal 6 inches of ripple then fine for rest of board putting it down to stress within log. Blade not waving at all on knots random clear sections when it does it.
r.garrison1
r.garrison1's picture
I would change grain (flat sawn or quartersawn) and see if it does the same. I have Tamarack (possibly Western Larch instead of true Tamarack) that I have cut, and haven't had any issues. It doesn't tend toward pitch, but I have experienced Ponderosa Pine with pitch pockets causing similar things. I actually have one half-sawn Pine log that I am wondering if I want to cut the rest; it had pitch so bad I could barely make it through the log.
Bill
Bill's picture
The ripple at the beginning is the blade stabilizing. I've only sawed a few Tamerac, they were green and sawed like butter once dry they can be very hard and brittle.
Jim Barker
Jim Barker's picture
Like I said I have never had problems with larch before. I have read that European Larch can cause problems. I would have two or three boards with no issues then random 6 inch noise like cutting through metal and then back to cutting good. Could happen at any point through a board. The marks aren’t straight across like blunt blade but circular so must be a change in grain.
r.garrison1
r.garrison1's picture
Here's another thought. In case it ISN'T the log, have you cut any other wood since this started? From the description, I would wonder if one of the guide rollers was seizing, or something like that. Maybe bearings on the band wheel? If the log is not the culprit, what other things could be a cause for an intermittent behavior like that.
Bill
Bill's picture
Could the drive belt be slipping ?
DavidM
DavidM's picture
I had a similar experience a while back and changed blades twice (new blades) so changed to an older blade that I had only sharpened twice. Problem disappeared so I went back and checked the box of new blades. Seems that 3 of the 10 new blades had almost no set - less than .06” on each tooth. I reset them and cleaned them up and they cut great - the thing I noticed was that with no set they ran very hot and collected pitch like crazy. Haven’t had any more problems with them.
eddiemac
eddiemac's picture
Yes. More often than not, mysterious sawing problems can be traced back to problems with the blade geometry - usually the set. Every sawyer needs to have a way to check hook angle and/or, at least, tooth set.
wayne busse
wayne busse's picture

Here's my two cents. I've had what I call chatter when sawing dry logs. I milled a bunch of tulip poplar, the live green trees cut smooth with no chatter but when I sawed standing dead trees that were very dry, I would get chatter in the first foot of the cut. It looks like raised ripples at a 20 degree angle and usually less than a foot down the log. Not to worry though, when we planned the boards the chatter was removed on the first pass through the planer. We air dried all our lumber for three years and the moisture won't go any lower than 10- 11%. My son found a great deal on some kiln dried walnut and oak so he bought a trailer load. Om my god what a load of crap,tons of dips and no two boards were the same thickness. The worst was a lot of boards were 1/4' different in thickness from one end to the other. He found out the hard way why it was such a great deal. We've run about 5,000 bdft of poplar and walnut from our own lumber cut on the Hd36 through the planer and never had a dip that took more than two passes. My son said, " Dad,your mill cuts perfectly compared to this crap I bought". I was always freaking out when I'd get a few dips cutting big hardwoods. If you're getting a lot of dips and you don't need wide boards, cut 6" slabs and then stand them on edge and cut 1" by 6" boards. I never get dips cutting this ways with the guides close together and the dips cutting the the slab are now on the edge of the boards and can be removed easily on the joiner. I've also put some dried ones back on the mill and straightened one edge cutting three or four at a time before a pass on the joiner. WE traded in our 16" Jet planer this summer for a 20" helical. Wish we had done this years ago. WE hit four nails in one of those purchased boards with the carbide cutters and they didn't leave a nick. WE also retired my old Craftsman joiner and got a 6" helical Jet.It only takes about ten minutes to rotate the cutters and we only had to rotate four where we always ran the boards. No adjusting entire blades, love it. Got my six month ct scan right before Christmass this winter. Again, no new tumors and just a tiny bit of growth in a couple lymph nodes and zero growth in the two in my liver, which are the important ones. The oncologist said at this rate of growth, my new and improved expiration date is around ten years. Looks like I've got a lot of sawing yet to do. I've not seen many photos since Norwood changed the forum,we have tons of photos if I knew how to post them.

eddiemac
eddiemac's picture
Glad to hear the health report, Wayne; looks like your new diet is working. If I ever need a new planer, I'll buy a spiral-head machine. With the Chinese tariff war going on, they're now even more expensive than they were. I guess an American-made (oh, never mind).
r.garrison1
r.garrison1's picture
Wayne, Good to hear about the prognosis. One thing to keep in mind is that 10 years is a long time for medical science to evolve; by that time, they will be able to 3d print you new parts. Keep sawing!
Jim Barker
Jim Barker's picture
Will have a look tomorrow at yard. Blades are uk made and sharpened by the same guy for the last five years. I would say looking at the boards some but not all of the ripple occurs when there are resin pockets and a wide grain, there can be some dip but not always. On the same board the blade will have cut perfectly through a knot. The noise created is high pitched resembling when you are cutting a very narrow piece or thickness. The same blades have squared up the same boards with no dips or dimension changes. Will check ceramic guides etc.
Post Oakie
Post Oakie's picture
Wayne, good to read your prognosis is looking good! Hope to be able to stop by on the way to or from the next Paul Bunyan show. Jim, you've got the right idea checking the guides. If the blade is dragging across a guide, it can heat up, stretch, and be a bit loose. Let us know.
Jim Barker
Jim Barker's picture
It would seem one of two problems. Muck in carriage wheels causing sawhead to rise up. Fixed guide, when removed it hasn’t caused the problem. Saw is now over five years and it seems bits are wearing up so overhaul soon I feel. Ceramics aren’t cheap here in the uk, probably run out of turns on them now. Another recent problem is it’s cutting 3mm or a kerf oversize on boards even when blade checked with the bunks and bed levelled.
Bill
Bill's picture
The ceramic guides don't put any down pressure on the blade which I didn't like. When I ordered the guides one ceramic had a flaw in it and broke so I made one out of hard wood and it worked every bit as well as the ceramic. It wasn't long before I took the ceramic guides off and went back to the original set up.
Jim Barker
Jim Barker's picture
Started again today, hunted round changing blade and filing track etc, etc then took apart idler greased up and set belt tight, think that might be it as Bill stated earlier in the thread, loose belt!! Bottle of scotch to that man!!
DavidM
DavidM's picture
Glad you got it figured out - I have fixed several problems by reading up on the forums. Most of those solutions came from the 5 old timers who answered your post besides me. If it’s not too much to ask, how many years experience are totaled up between Post oakie, Bill, Eddiemac, Wayne and r.garrison? I’m not sure how many years but bet it’s a lot - I know that you guys have helped me. Thank you 😊
r.garrison1
r.garrison1's picture
I've only been sawing for 6 years, but I have a bit of history with playing with wood. My first real job in 1972 was pulling trim chain and stacking cants at a stud mill. I've also had desk jobs, but prefer to do stuff with my hands; it is more satisfying.
eddiemac
eddiemac's picture
I've been sawing since 2004, but did some woodworking before. I built my house out of native oak lumber, beginning in 1974.
Bill
Bill's picture
Had the mill since approx. 2000 bought it to try and deal with all the dying birch but soon found out I couldn't keep up and with birch there's to much waste. I've bee working over 60 ty years and still having fun.
Jim Barker
Jim Barker's picture
Sadly still playing up, it’s now taken to diving in the cut, belt or idler pulley?
r.garrison1
r.garrison1's picture
How tight do you get your blades? One thing I wonder is if the adjustment is getting a bit rusty or sticky, if you tighten the same as usual for how hard it is to crank the handle, it may not be tightening.
DavidM
DavidM's picture
Hate to hear that - I would try sawing something different to see if it’s the wood or the machine. You might also call Norwood and see if they have any ideas - hope you get it figured out soon. Frustrating to keep having the same problem over and over.
DavidM
DavidM's picture
Hate to hear that - I would try sawing something different to see if it’s the wood or the machine. You might also call Norwood and see if they have any ideas - hope you get it figured out soon. Frustrating to keep having the same problem over and over.
Bill
Bill's picture
Jim when you adjust your idler I found it takes me quiet a while to get it right because when I start out with the belt centered and rev up the motor the belt heads for the out side cause premature belt where. If I adjust so it's 1/2 a belt width towards the machine it centers when revved. I found with ceramic guides you have no down pressure on the blade so the blade is floating in the guides causing the larger Cerf is my guess.
Post Oakie
Post Oakie's picture
Refresh my memory... which mill are you running? You might track the blade back a little on the bandwheels. That tips them up a bit. My sawmilling started assisting at an old circle mill in the early 1980s to cut lumber for my house. Been running band mills about 20 years, Norwood mill since 2011 (8-1/2years).
kirk
kirk's picture
Hello oakie, I was going thru the forum reading a lot of post read one that said you do the videos for norwood? One in particular if you are the person, you were doing start up check on an hd36. Leveling the blade with a little level you glued to a magnet. I tried to do that on my lm29 with all new belts, saw head is level to each bunk, tack is level from beginning to end , adjusted tracking so that blade is riding even, guilt is riding flush with band wheel where norwood say"s it should be. Just can"t get the blade level the way it was done on the video
Jim Barker
Jim Barker's picture
Well seem to be there with it now. Dealer put me onto a YouTube video with a guy having the same problem. The inside of the coiled blade or top side when between the guides cakes with sawdust till thick and also sticks to the band wheels causing blade to move about up and down. Have never really used water and has never happened before when not using lub. Now doing it all the time on any species so back to water lub.
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